Darth Stunty - He who will bring balance to the Stunts...

[DamnDirtyApe]

Firstly, this my first post, so howdy!

In our league, we had a few owners who wanted to play Halflings and Goblins (despite the warning from some of us). Well we just finished the season and they combined for a 1 - 24 - 1 record. Don't be fooled by the 1 win and 1 tie, those were verses each other, they were 0 - 24 against the rest of the league. These owners figured that they'd have a uphill battle, yet they hadn't expected it to be so bad. Don't get me wrong, these guys were good sports about it, but they wished they could be a tad more competitive.

Now we are starting a second season, and we wanted to see if there were any house rules we could add that would help out the stunties. After discussing it at great length, and searching the net for ideas, we settled on the following:

Note: Many of these are derivatives of rules found at: http://home.worldonline.dk/nyskes/bbowl/Bloodbowl.htm:

1) Stunty on longer adds a +1 to the injury rolls. The armor values of Halflings/Goblins are low enough as it is. Adding the +1 is overkill.

2) Team changes (see below)

Goblin Team
0-16 Goblins 40K 6 2 3 7 Dodge, Stunty, Right Stuff AG

0-2 Goblin Catchers 60K 7 2 3 6 Dodge, Stunty, Right Stuff, Catch AG

0-2 Goblin Hooligans 60K 5 3 2 8 Dodge, Stunty, Dirty Player AG

Added a few goblin catchers and a couple of beefy Goblins w/ Dirty Player (This goes with the classic idea of goblin cheating).


Halfling Team

0-16 Halflings 30K 5 2 3 6 Dodge, Stunty, Right Stuff AG, PS

0-4 Halfling Fatfellows 60K 5 3 3 7 Dodge, Stand Firm AG, PS

Added some beefy halflings, All Halflings can access pas skills. I like the idea that they are predisposed to throwing lots of short passes. (kind of like "hot potato' Mmmm ... potato).

Of course, Halfling and Goblins will still be able to recruit up to 2 big guys, per the standard rules.

Do you think that this will do the trick? What we are looking for is to improve them to the point where winning games should not be an amazing event which happens every blue moon. On the other hand, we certainly don't want them to become powerhouses! They are stunty after all...

- DamnDirtyApe

[Grumbledook]

stand firm on a halfling lololololol ;]
i like that


I can't see that making a great deal of difference but might make them more fun to play

those teams aren't designed to win but with the right tactics you can pull off some wins.

and welcome aboard

[Balrog]

Stunty teams play very differently then regular teams. I went 1-1-3 in my first seasons with Halflings, and the fact that only one team ever beat is very funny.

In our league we house ruled that the halfling coach is in fact the master chef, and goblins can have up to four secret weapons (but all of them must be different). The master chef definitely made a difference as two of the teams I played against were brought down to 0 rerolls for the game.

I don't agree with removing the +1 to injury, but the rest looks good.

-Balrog

[Zombie]

Well, last time i played halflings i finished the season with a .500 record. We have no house rules regarding them and back then, ogres costed 240k so i only took treemen. Stunties are actually pretty decent in low TR range.

I suspect that the two coaches in your league are not very good and would have lost a lot of games no matter what team they played. I don't think that changing the rules will help them much. Be careful that you don't give them too much every season trying to equalize things, or you'll eventually find yourself with a good coach taking stunties and beating everyone!

[DamnDirtyApe]

We tried a playtest of the rules and...

Lets say it didn't work-out very well. The 4 Halflings with Stand Firm were to much of an improvement. Stand Firm, when combined with dodge meant that it was very hard to actually knock them down/around (when using a player without block). The Halflings ended up playing more like dwarves, which we didn't like... So we went back to the drawing board.

Here our latest proposed house rules...

1) Remove the injury penalty for stunty.

2) Give Halflings and Goblins one free roll on the handicap table.

3) Give Halflings and Goblins +1 on the Fan Factor roll at the end of the game.

4) Give each Halfling who is still on the field at the end of each half +1 SPP.

5) Give each Goblin who injures a downed player via a foul + 2 SPP.

6) Halfling can hire a master Chef at beginning of the season for 150K

7) Goblins can purchase a Weapons Cache* at beginning of the season for 150K.

* Goblins with a weapon cache can use secret weapons (Ball and Chain, Bomb, Chainsaw, or Pogostick). The coach needs to roll a d6 at the start of the match, they roll a d6 then divide by (rounding down) to see how many weapons they get to use for the days match. (ex 1=0, 2,3=1, 4,5=2 6=3).

8 ) Remove negatraits for Big guys. They can remove a negative trait (Really stupid, Wild Animal, etc) rather than choosing a new skill/trait. If you'll notice, the star player big guys don't have these negative traits, so they must have gotten rid of them somehow. This way you team can build the next Morg N' Thorg.

Rational for some of these rules:
Sure, stunties will lose. Sure, stunties will get beat up. But the fans like them and those who survive will get stronger. They will also be able to replace injured players faster than other teams. And they will soon start racking up rolls on the handicap table.

What do you think... ?

[Zombie]

Give me either team with these rules and i'd totally crush any other team in the game. You're making them WAY too good. Like i said, you should try teaching the two coaches how to play the game instead of changing the teams.

[ZanzerTem]

Fling Fatfellows and the Gobbo Hooligans should not get AGI skills. Change those to General. Otherwise, everything looks decent to houserule and playtest. Make sure that your commish makes it perfectly clear that these are TEST rules and can be subject to change. Don't want to discover it being overpowered and have a couple of upset coaches

Like Zombie said, those 2 coaches suck. 1/2lings, and gobbos especially, can easily eek out a commendable 25% win ratio, 25-50% for the better coaches. But ZERO wins out of 24? Wow, I don't think I could even do that on purpose no matter what team I played.......

[DamnDirtyApe]

Zombie - Yes, I can see where you are coming from. Which of those rules do you feel is too severe?

[Zombie]

Zombie - Yes, I can see where you are coming from. Which of those rules do you feel is too severe?

Let's see...

1) Remove the injury penalty for stunty.
Bad call. They should break easily.

2) Give Halflings and Goblins one free roll on the handicap table.
Unnecessary exception.

3) Give Halflings and Goblins +1 on the Fan Factor roll at the end of the game.
Idem.

4) Give each Halfling who is still on the field at the end of each half +1 SPP.
WAY overpowered.

5) Give each Goblin who injures a downed player via a foul + 2 SPP.
Again, unnecessary exception. The fewer the better.

6) Halfling can hire a master Chef at beginning of the season for 150K.
I believe that something like this is in the works and might become official come next October. It's the one that make the most sense but i would rule against it in my league.

7) Goblins can purchase a Weapons Cache* at beginning of the season for 150K.
Unnecessary added complexity.

8 ) Remove negatraits for Big guys. They can remove a negative trait (Really stupid, Wild Animal, etc) rather than choosing a new skill/trait. If you'll notice, the star player big guys don't have these negative traits, so they must have gotten rid of them somehow. This way you team can build the next Morg N' Thorg.
Overpowered, bad exception to the big guy rules, overall bad call.

[ZanzerTem]

Ok, your 1st post was good, but your 2nd was absolutely horrible! Lets go back:

Team changes (see below)

Goblin Team
0-16 Goblins 40K 6 2 3 7 Dodge, Stunty, Right Stuff AG

0-2 Goblin Catchers 60K 7 2 3 6 Dodge, Stunty, Right Stuff, Catch AG

0-2 Goblin Hooligans 60K 5 3 2 8 Dodge, Stunty, Dirty Player AG

Added a few goblin catchers and a couple of beefy Goblins w/ Dirty Player (This goes with the classic idea of goblin cheating).

Drop Catcher movement back to 6.

Drop AG skills on Hooligans (they have AGI 2 for pete's sake )

Other then that, should play well.

Halfling Team

0-16 Halflings 30K 5 2 3 6 Dodge, Stunty, Right Stuff AG, PS

0-4 Halfling Fatfellows 60K 5 3 3 7 Dodge, Stand Firm AG, PS

Added some beefy halflings, All Halflings can access pas skills. I like the idea that they are predisposed to throwing lots of short passes. (kind of like "hot potato' Mmmm ... potato).

For the fatfellows, drop Stand Firm and give them Block instead. TAKE AWAY AGI SKILLS! give them general only. Block and dodge are a good combo, but not overly powerful. Drop their STR to 2, and they won't play like dwarves anymore!

You have to realize something.....they are stunties! they are supposed to suck! That is the fun in playing them; so when you actually do win, you get a fuzzy feeling inside and can taunt your opponent mercilessly!!

[ZanzerTem]

Zombie is right on the nose for your 2nd post.

Another suggestion for the fatfellows would be a Dodge/Dauntless combo, or maybe a Block/Dauntless combo. If you did that, limit them to 2 or 3. 4 is too much for Block/Dauntless players.

Be sure to adjust the price to reflect this though.

[GalakStarscraper]

Okay seriously as a long time stunty player, I agree with the vast majority of Zombie's comments.

He is correct that either this or next October the rules for the Halfling Master Chef will probably be changed to this:

Code: Select all

The Master Chef is free for Halfling teams (in fact he's the head coach).  The Master Chef allows the team to roll a D6 before each half, on a 2 or more, the Halfling team gains one reroll for that half.  In addition, if the opposing team has any rerolls they lose one for that half.

For every 20k the Master Chef spends in the pre-game for extra ingredients, the Master Chef may roll an extra D6 before each half.  You must spend this money before rolling for the 1st half.

Then use the Secret Weapons rules in BB Mag #5 to help out the Goblin team.

These would be the only two changes to the team I would make as they are probably coming down the pike anyway to officialdom. Oh and in October, the Stunties are either going to lose access to Ogres (Halflings) or they are going back to costing 240k to purchase (Goblins).

The ONLY other thing I would even consider in an LRB league if you wanted to help the Stunty teams out. Remove the range band modifiers from Throw TeamMate passes ... I think Zombie's league does this anyway ... not sure .. sorry Zombie if I'm wrong. This change definitely really helps a Stunty team out.

But the above is it. The Stunty teams are there to be a challenge; not equals. In my league, I'm actually very proud of my 2-8 record with my Halfling team. Wins were produced against a Goblin and a Norse team. And no team has ever held me scoreless in all 10 games. Only 2 teams have won by more than 1 TD (Dark Elf and Vampire). I've faced a tough 10 game cycle also .. in order (Lizardman, Orc, Chaos Dwarf, Goblin, Dark Elf, Norse, Skaven, Vampire, Vampire, Goblin)

Its not Zombie's 50% record granted, but it a respectable run with a difficult team (Having 2 Treemen killed in those 10 games hasn't helped that record to say the least ... those guys take 2 to 3 games to replace ... )

Galak

[DamnDirtyApe]

OK, guys. I see your point. You are right though, the guys who played the stunties could really use some practice. I think we'll keep the rules as is for the next season. If they complain, I'll take up the challenge and play halfling this season. I should be able to get a few wins. That will show them what's possible with the Stunties!

- DDA

[GalakStarscraper]

DDA ... you posted 2 seconds after me ... please read the above.

Galak

[DamnDirtyApe]

Ogres will be removed as BG options for Halflings come the next LRB review, eh? And double for Goblins? That news is bound to bum out our Halfling coach... He bought 2 Ogres just for that team.

I can only imagine how much complaining he'll start with...

Galak, you have that info on a pretty reliable source? Also, what is prompting that change in the rules?

- DDA