Ogre with MA4 rolls 12

[narg]

I've got a fairly new ogre team (I played only 6 games with them), and my injured ogre with -MA rolled a 12 on his first skill. I didn't get any doubles yet so apart from him I have two ogres with Break Tackle and one with Break Tackle and Juggernaut (I score with ogres so they skill up fairly quickly).

It is usually advised to take the double, not the strength increase. Is it really valid in this case? With MA4 he's just going to be standing around in the middle of the pitch really. With ST6 he just needs an assist to get a 3D block against the average opponent, and with guard and stand firm next he'll be a real pain.

[Chris]

I would take block. In fact on all big guys bar the nurgle beast and maybe a tree I would take block.

[burgun824]

MA 4.....hmmmm tough call. If you really want the stat increase then take it. You're the one that's going to be using him and a ST6 ogre will be a pain to deal with.

Block would be the obvious alternative, but I see where you're coming from.

[fidius]

ST6 is useful to turn Multiple Block blocks into 2 dice vs ST3 teams. Tends to force weaker teams to spread out their defensive LOS, and yields surprise opportunities in-game. Or take Break Tackle next and "dodge" into 2 tackle zones on a 2+... Break into a standard cage on a 3+... Sure it's only MA4 but he can go where he wants and no one can stop him. I'd totally take the ST.

[Hitonagashi]

Probability of failing a 3d without block: 1/27
Probability of failing a 2d with block: 1/36

It also gives you higher reliability against incoming hits...though, I admit if a ST 6 dude is tying up players, he's great, if he's tied up by a single rookie lineman, he's rubbish, *especially* without block.

In fact on all big guys bar the nurgle beast and maybe a tree I would take block.

I'd take +ST on a mino. You should only take them if you intend to be blitzing with them, and +ST gives them a 3d every time they use their horns, and Juggs negates a lot of the downside of no block.

Having said all that, +ST is always cool, and a ST 6 piece is scary for a basher. Quite a few bashers see it as a challenge to put every man on the ground, so even if the optimal play is to feed him a lino and ignore him, they'll sometimes gang their entire team around him, which is where he shines.

As per usual with +ST / Block arguments, it's all down to how your opponents typically engage him. Gang up on him, +ST, manmark and ignore, block.

[SunDevil]

I am usually all about the Block over +ST on bigs (Nurgle Beast the primary exception, though I certainly see Hitonagashi's point concerning Minos) but this Ogre's -MV makes the choice interesting.

Heck, I'd go +ST just to find out, since he is so slow. Look for BT next (short range cage breaker dodging into 3 TZs for a 3!) or Guard. Block would be amazing.

I'm starting an Ogre team in the FUMBBL 3DB2 league, I hope I have this choice to make soon.

[Axtklinge]

I see the point in both arguments, however, I'm quite sure I'd choose the Block over the ST.
Block would make him more reliable (both on offence and defence).

[narg]

Right, in the end I took the +ST, maybe not very smart but it's done. In the next game I played against Khemri where the +ST was definitely useful to be able to get 2D blocks on the Guardians, and 2D blocks without Block are better than 1D blocks without Block so in that game at least it was definitely a good choice. And I think it's good as well to take out treemen and trolls (I tend to play that team mostly against other tier 2 or tier 3 teams).

Okay, another problem for you: in my last game my star ogre, with break tackle and juggernaut rolled...12! So same question, different context. He's now my ball carrier, and juggernaut is great on him as I blitz and dodge with him - usually the opponent sends lots of players to contact with him but with a good blitz (just not a double skulls) and a 2+ on the dodge I'm out of there and I can move forward to score. Block, dodge and sure hands are all great for a ball carrier, but then again +ST helps on the break tackle and helps to get a 2D block as well when he's surrounded by four or five opponents (bonehead and snots don't make for a good cage).

Too many possibilities!

[Heff]

str

[narg]

str

LOL

Very good arguments!
;o)

[Heff]

OK long answer

Take strength. To get two dice on you he needs 4 assists, leaving 6 players to be beaten up by your 10. STR is like having an assist with Guard all the time. You can break tackle in zones very easily, one assist = 3 dice. Also if he concentrates on this guy then Glacial Joe can move up with his str 6 and Bat em.give them both guard and then if they stand next to each other you may have 2 3 dice blocks off the bat on the LOS. they are a big roadblock in the path of anybody. One on each wing will provide a good barrier, Ogres Job is often to just stand in the way. At str 6 they are better at this. They provide an excellent fear factor. Minos will only get one dice when blitzing you without an assist. You might be blessed with another +str and to get str 7 you need str6.

So
TAKE STRENGTH

[Nikolai II]

Big guys should usually take block instead of strength, but there are exceptions.

Beast of Nurgle / other player with tentacles - Strength always.

Halfling and Ogre teams - no loner means reliable rerolling - take strength if you get it.

Other teams - if your goal definitely is only to be a roadblock, or you think you'll get another double later, take strength.

[Drool_bucket]

complete agreement with the above post.

Tentacles equal STR
Big Guys with no Loner equal STR

everyone else, Treeman included, is Block.

This sound advice aside, I also strictly believe that if you take Block, the next skill up will be doubles, as Nuffle loves to teach lessons. (and punish the greedy, the over confident and those who GFI near the chalk line)

[burgun824]

On a completely different note...I have to admit that I'm mildly disturbed by Drool_bucket's profile pic. Not a fan of being starred at by Lovecraft.

[Itchen Masack]

You 'should' always take block, but then I struggle to pass up Str 6 on an ogre! Depends how long you expect the team to run for I reckon. Playing online where you can play many many games, I will take the Str 6 and hope to roll a double for block later on.

But then now I said that, wouldnt it be nice to take tackle on the 2nd double...hmmmm... well in that case, Take +1 Str and just keep rolling doubles :p