The Fitch is Back- Bitz and Bobz and a Dwarf

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fitch-face
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The Fitch is Back- Bitz and Bobz and a Dwarf

Post by fitch-face »

Hey guys, hope I'm posting this in the right place, just wanted to start a plog but I'll introduce myself first! I just joined up today but I've been lurking here for a long time now, checking out your minis and reading through your forum :P I used to play Warhammer, 40K, Mordheim, Blood Bowl and LotR until about 2004 and since then I've only played Blood Bowl on and off. It's been about 3 years since I last tried playing Blood Bowl and I've lost all my old models so it's a fresh start for me!

I've got some marauders and marauder horsemen on the way (hopefully) to start a Norse team. I've never played as Norse before and I'm quite excited for the modelling opportunities.

So while I'm bored and waiting, I've decided to attempt to scratch build a yhetee.

This is what he looks like so far, no detail as of yet but I only started today, just been trying to get the wire into a shape I like and get a basic outline for his body. I've never scratch-built a whole model before but I've done some pretty extensive conversions in my time so hopefully it'll be ok.
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Shteve0
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Re: Fitch Face's Norse Plog

Post by Shteve0 »

Welcome! Look forward to following your progress on this :)

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Re: Fitch Face's Norse Plog

Post by fitch-face »

Thanks mate, I love the sense of community here, everyone seems very helpful and friendly.


I wouldn’t usually update with such measly offerings but just wanted to say that I phoned Total Wargamer and they sent out my order next-day-courier. Couldn’t recommend them more, cheap plastic sets with excellent, friendly service.


And some very minor updates on the troll as I have gorilla paws and trying to do too much at a time just causes excessive smudging. Anyway, I’ve added some musculature which is the first/second layer of about three or four layers as it’s a large model. I also realised that due to a mathematical error involving 40mm bases and 50mm bases, he is going to be about 25% taller than I had wanted. Not a big problem but in my opinion, this is probably the difference between ST5 and ST6. But we'll see!

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Just a heads up, read my next post if you want to be bored to death by talk of sculpting muscles. If not, I hope to see you the next time I have an update, maybe with some converted players!

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Re: Fitch Face's Norse Plog; Troll Anatomy 101

Post by fitch-face »

Troll Anatomy 101
I honestly believe that going to the gym has helped me understand how to sculpt better because you create mind-muscle connections and learn how to use your muscles to move your body in certain ways. As you can see on my yhetee, his pecs (chest muscles) are slightly different shapes and look slightly different in size. In reality, I used the same amount of green stuff, moulded into roughly the same shape before adding them to the mini. I then stretched and smoothed the muscle so that both muscles were attached to the correct point on the model; the right pec looks smaller as it is in a stretched position whereas the left side of his upper body is in a pronated position (shoulders forward, palms down) and the chest is naturally more tensed. The opposite is true of the delts (shoulder muscles), where the right is naturally more tensed. I’d taken pictures of myself in the yhetee’s position for reference but the real difficulty here is translating human physique onto the frame of a trollish beast. As humanoids they would have the same basic musculature but with different positioning and proportions which is proving a little bit of a challenge.

So I created for myself a troll anatomy guide based partially on a stone troll, just for reference.

Image

The two top drawings are sketches of a stone troll as it’s fairly similar to the shape I’m going for. I then tried to work out where humanoid muscles would be placed within that frame and what sort of size they’d be. The lower picture is an example of the final piece I’m going for but with the arm in a different position for simplicity. What’s cool about this is I can create a scale version of the anatomy on my computer screen, allowing me to clearly see what size and shape i need to make out of greenstuff before adding it to the model.

I’ve some concerns about how small his pecs are at the minute as you’d expect someone with such a hyper-pronated stance to have very powerfully built pecs and biceps and relatively underdeveloped back muscles. This guy, however has a huge back and quite a small chest. I guess climbing mountains and picking up rocks and such all day might give you a hunched appearance along with a hypertrophied back. I’m gonna go with that explanation :P

Sorry if that was a boring read, muscular anatomy fascinates me and I thought it might be useful for some beginner sculptors like myself out there. Let me know if you want any more explanation.

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Re: Fitch Face's Norse Plog

Post by Aflo »

Nice, I'll be following this.

As for the pec situation I reckon it makes perfect sense for them to be relatively underdeveloped. His hunch could be explained just by his skeletal structure, creating a squatter, more stable frame like an extreme neanderthal. Unlike a neanderthal though I can't see him doing many pushing or thrusting actions with his arms as he's more likely to be pulling himself/rocks around and hurling/bashing rather than stabbing. The biggest thing to me (which admittedly is a tough fix and an extreme nit-pick given it's a fantasy creature) is the size of the guys quads and hams, though that's somewhat fixed by an apelike knuckle-walk.

Anyhow, good luck with it.

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Fitch Face's Norse Plog

Post by Shteve0 »

For my own snow troll, I've been working on a plastic rat ogre from the island of blood set (here's the original mini, painting not mine: http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_ts1HdLGjywM/T ... t_ogre.JPG). He too has a massive back, underdeveloped pecs and frankly redonkulous hands... But, for me, the look works.

Good to see an update, and your personal recommendation of a supplier - i've looked at TW before, but never tried them. Incidentally, I've used Wayland Games in the past, and they often do free delivery, which can tip the balance over TW for larger orders.

Cheers!

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Re: Fitch Face's Norse Plog

Post by fitch-face »

Thanks for the feedback guys. I'm getting more and more nervous as I get towards sculpting the parts that actually matter like head and hands so any feedback and constructive criticism I get before than is welcomed with open arms

@Aflo, I had a problem with his legs too. I feel like they should be longer but they are scale-wise the same as a GW stone troll which I've seen some people using as a yhetee (and like you said it is a fantasy creature) so I'm not too bothered. I was debating sawing a section out of his torso to make that shorter and give him slightly longer legs. It is a tough fix though, I think the best option now is to follow through with the model as it is and if I don't like it I'll use it as a prototype and learn from my mistakes.

@Shteve0, I thought about Wayland Games too, I think TW was 50p cheaper than Wayland at the time of purchase, and then when Wayland games had their free shipping they became 50p cheaper than TW so I missed out on a rate bargain there! :P
Would love to see the rat ogre when you've finished, what sort of head will you be using? I've seen someone who used them as werewolves which looked grand, if a little large!

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Re: Fitch Face's Norse Plog

Post by Lunchab1es »

I'm looking forward to how this fella (and the rest of your team) turns out. FWIW, I thought the drawing/plan/reference was totally cool.

Welcome to the forums.

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Re: Fitch Face's Norse Plog

Post by juck101 »

Cool Drawing. Great idea

I think the back is too developed compared to the legs. He would not be able to support his body with such small legs. Also the top abdominals are open and the lower section is bulging. I think with a 10-15 fat Bmi the top bit would still not be visible. No worry as its a cool fig by your troll needs a bit more fat I recon overall

I'm so impressed with the sculpt and love the prep

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Re: Fitch Face's Norse Plog

Post by fitch-face »

Thanks a lot for the feedback and support guys :) It being my first ever sculpt it's nice to know people are liking what they see!

@Lunchab1es Cheers buddy, I’m glad you liked the drawings. I'll try not to disappoint!

@juck101 Thanks mate. You’re totally right, I didn't do his back muscles very big in the end. I also see your point about legs but I'm not too bothered. As it stands the GW stone trolls have much bigger backs and skinnier legs than I'm going for. The stone trolls also have the big belly with the visible upper body muscles, as do apes in real life. In nature, big bellies don't necessarily mean lots of body fat (it's just us podgy humans :P)

To illustrate, here’s Ambam the gorilla. You can see that despite his huge gut, his abs and pecs are clearly visible. And despite his short legs, he is able to hold his huge body upright for short amounts of time. http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_Hbo7Ung0Hbg/T ... orilla.jpg

But thanks for the constructive criticism, it does help to think about these things and I do like to be biologically feasible!

Here's a progress shot, it's a pretty awful photo but you get the gist. And for a better idea, here's a video I shot of him on Youtube http://youtu.be/aSDh5Fqt1iQ
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Re: Fitch Face's Norse Plog

Post by Lunchab1es »

Fantastic face! Very smooth handiwork. I also like that you can see the muscle fibers from his pecs. This guy is going to turn out really well.

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Re: Fitch Face's Norse Plog

Post by fitch-face »

Lunchab1es wrote:Fantastic face! Very smooth handiwork. I also like that you can see the muscle fibers from his pecs. This guy is going to turn out really well.
Cheers dude, it's coming along slowly! I wasn't expecting anyone to pick up on the fact that I'd messed around trying to do muscle fibres, you obviously have a good eye :P

Here's a quick update, the face has changed a little, you can now see where I'm going with it a bit better. I originally wanted to give him a skull as a helmet but I'm quite happy with the face and feel like it'd be a shame to cover it up. Again, the photo is pretty rubbish so here's a YouTube video I shot http://youtu.be/Jvhuf1yyaqM Let me know what you guys think.

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Re: Fitch Face's Norse Plog

Post by burgun824 »

You sir, have an incredible amount of what I like to call 'Toomuchtime.'

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Re: Fitch Face's Norse Plog

Post by barnacle111 »

The face is very good and like the chest/shoulders. Obviously this is early doors, but the current abdominal muscles don't work for me. And this is entirely a personal thing, but maybe less definition (appears to be a very deep midline), and more shaping as the other lateral abdominal muscles play a part on the sides of the abdominal area. But impressed, and look forward to watching progression.

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Fitch Face's Norse Plog

Post by Shteve0 »

Looking good! The head looks good, particularly in the video.
fitch-face wrote:Would love to see the rat ogre when you've finished, what sort of head will you be using? I've seen someone who used them as werewolves which looked grand, if a little large!
All my projects are on hold at the mo while I travel a while, so any further work is some months away, but in what I've done so far I've used this head left over from some pestigors/horrors I put together: http://www.bitzbox.co.uk/images/daemons ... _large.jpg

When he's done, I'm looking at pairing him with some of the wendigo models from the WarGods range, as used for ulfs (rather brilliantly) by gus_the_hut over here: http://talkfantasyfootball.org/viewtopi ... 23&t=36363

The rat ogre model is bloody massive though, borderline S6. He dwarfs Morg... I think he'd be way too big for a werewolf. But then again, granny loves her some scale creep ;)

anyway, good luck, keep the updates coming :)

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