Amazons Fantasy Football Team from Necrom Studio

[GalakStarscraper]

Flexible funding means the pledge goes ahead no matter what, so the company is committing to the project regardless of reaching their preferred goal.

Fixed funding is like KS, where you are only charged if the goal is reached.

Yeah, I get that. But if the campaign struggles to make 20% of its goal, I worry that the commitment might waver. I might prefer fixed funding in this case, as I don't know much about the company.

Darkson ... with Flexible Funding ... they are sent your Payment no matter how far they miss their funding goal ... if they only get 1% of their funding goal ... they still get your money. KickStarter and Fixed Funding on Indiegogo are the better system of they only get your money if they get enough to properly do the project.

For me the risk is too much of a factor. If I pledge on a Flexible Funding project ... they get my money and I have no recourse if they then fail to make the item.

Given that with Flexible Funding they are promising to make the team even if they don't reach their goal ... then there is no reason at all to pledge ever for a Flexible Funding project as its just a pre-order for something they are making anyway (unless you think you are getting a strong discount OR stretch goal extras are really cool). I personally would normally rather wait and pay maybe a little extra for the team when they are actually produced than to pledge for a Flexible Funding project that only makes 20% and then find out they've decided to not make the team and I cannot get my money back as I have no options. At least with buying it from their store since they promised to make them no matter what ... I have fairly good options to get my money back through either PayPal or my credit card if they don't ship my order in 5 weeks.

Just a risk/reward thing for me. I personally do not believe in pledging for Flexible Funding projects ... I'd rather wait until they show up in their store as they have already promised to do no matter what and buy them at that time.

Tom (speaking as Tom the gamer (not anything related to Tom - store owner))

[Virral]

Gaxio - i was responding to Darkson more than you

There is also no guarantee or recourse with a fixed funding project either of course. They also fall through despite reaching their goals.

That said, I would generally feel.more comfortable contribiting to fixed funding, unless its a reputable store and/or they were well on their way to target funding.

As an aside, flex funding can help you get the project underway faster. Lets say its a mini project with 40 days left and they reach goal. With indiegogo and flex funding, you have the cash and can start production immediately. With KS you have to wait until the 40 days left are over. I was able to pay all the setup fees etc for my project well before it finished, meaning it should ship a full month earlier than expected.

[Heff]

They are really nice but every one is on one leg, am I right to worry that they will snap at the ankle?
being resin I guess pinning would be easy.

[Palomares]

I have been asked several times about what is going to happen if I don't manage to get the 5.000$ in Indiegogo. Hereby I make clear that no one is going to loose her money. I commit myself to produce the team, even if I have to put some money of my own. I have explained this in the Indiegogo website, hence if you want to support the project and get all the benefits, please do so without any worries.

Thank you again for your support. Best wishes,

Palomares.

[Mephisto]

I don't know what has happened in the last years, but guys...

we are being presented with new products to increase (and improve) the current range available to us, and instead of being supportive there is an exaggerated aggresivity towards smaller firms/sculptors and to a certain extent to Spanish people. I don't understand why. Here is a guy who is putting a lot of effort, money, and time into a great project and instead of pushing him to continue with his good work, people are only criticing.

And come on, this guy has done some previous nice work like the orc team and I don't know of anyone who has ordered one and then not gotten it... so please... if you are not interested do not pledge. If you have some constructive comments, post them. But if you just want to troll around, I think the warhammer forums are best suited than this community.

[Heff]

Me I am christmassed out and suspicious of resin for blood bowl, if either were not the case I would take a punt.

[Darkson]

But if you just want to troll around, I think the warhammer forums are best suited than this community.

I'm failing to see the trolling.

[Shteve0]

instead of being supportive there is an exaggerated aggresivity towards ... Spanish people.

That's a pretty alarming accusation, mate. I've no idea how you've come to that conclusion, I've seen nothing to support it myself.

If you have some constructive comments, post them. But if you just want to troll around...

I'm also pretty happy in my own mind that the majority of comments have been nothing but constructive, working to express (or allay) any concerns of the posters in question. The only bona fide trolling I've seen is your off-the-cuff accusation of board bigotry above!

[Bsking]

But if you just want to troll around, I think the warhammer forums are best suited than this community.

I'm failing to see the trolling.

Maybe not trolling, but I can understand Mephisto's sentiment in that this thread has had a distinctly negative tone throughout.

In my opinion, I think Palomeres has done a great job. He has put together some nice ideas, and managed to incorporate the community feedback into the production models. A great business model, and I hope he continues to make more teams using the same methodology.

[Mephisto]

Sorry, trolling is the wrong word. Bsking is probably expressing it better, when he refers to the distinct negatively thought.

@Shteve0: Similar bad negative attitude in the Willi Miniatures posts. And especially in this case, if there are some worries about "security", one can contact the author and suggest him for next time to have a fixed campaign or to provide some payment security. But telling people to wait until the team has been completed and buy it from the owner's store is not really helpful.

I can understand that there is some mistrust due to Maelstrom's attitude, but BB has been usually a trustworthy community.

Perhaps I have not expressed myself right in my previous post. What I am saying is that instead of undermining new projects, we should encourage them. Certain negative comments and creating an atmosphere of distrust are not really helpful in promoting and encouraging new projects.

[Don__Vito]

Doesn't matter what I think of the project or team or owner, I don't have over a hundred dollars to spare so soon after Christmas.

[Corvidius]

I do think they look pretty cool and I was impressed at how quickly the sculptor included community feedback and worked on the size issues but sadly I am also skint with little need for an Amazon team. I do commend the sculptor on his work though. Nicely done.

[Pakulkan]

Given that with Flexible Funding they are promising to make the team even if they don't reach their goal ... then there is no reason at all to pledge ever for a Flexible Funding project as its just a pre-order for something they are making anyway (unless you think you are getting a strong discount OR stretch goal extras are really cool).

I think this comment exemplify how we all are losing the point.

Talking in general, not specifically about Palomares campaign, Indiegogo and Kickstarter are websites launched to SUPPORT projects that customers find interesting.

No matter if the company makes the team even if the goal is not reached. These platforms are allowing you to support, encourage and speed up projects of your interest.

On the other hand, I do remember an article about how a number of fixed campaings are far away from their planned delivery dates while they are proposing more and more kickstarter fixed funding projects.

If someone wants to cheat you, remember he could try to do so in fixed funding as well.

In particular, about Palomares. We are dealing with a new company, I guess we need to provide him a little bit of suport and credit. For example Greebo stopped a promotion in spanish forum after the preorders, so no matter how well known are you, you could also fail. I should include myself in the bunch, as the casting of my dwarves are being delayed and delayed by the casting company...

[GalakStarscraper]

The problem is Pakulkan that while the BB community is trustworthy ... the flexible funding has holes in it.

A fantasy football team was just recently on Indiegogo for 2 months and was under Flexible Funding. They started by saying it would be made and yesterday they announced that they were going to be trying to refund everyone's money as they still planned to make the team someday but not in a timely manner to get the pledges out.

I have no doubt that they'll get the refunds out ... but if they had done a Fixed Funding campaign there would be no need for trying to figure out refunds or announcing cancelling the project.

So my post was nothing at all about not supporting this line. I hope they succeed. In the last week, we've just placed a 2000E order with Willy, a $1200 payment to MKUltra and sent commission payments to Rykar for the Necromonicom figures so I definitely have nothing out for the Spanish designers at all (as all 3 are Spanish designers).

I personally strongly dislike the Flexible Funding method of Indiegogo. It offers all the risk to the person making the pledge with no upsides at all. Had Necrom Studio done this project as a Fixed Funding campaign for say $1000 if they were certain they were making the team no matter what ... that would have been a better designed campaign.

Given that we JUST HAD yesterday a Flexible Funding campaign go belly up for FF figures and now its a mess that would not have happened if it had been Fixced Funding ... I don't think my post was out of line.

Again ... I hope they sell well for Necrom Studios. I also hope that future FF projects on Indiegogo use only the Fixed Funding method. We back a lot of projects on KickStarter right now ... if this project had been Fixed Funded I would have been willing to back it as well.

So this is NOT a comment on Necrom Studios ... its a comment on risk and reward of pledging on crowdsourcing and like I said ... just yesterday my comments were proven to have merit.

Tom

[Pakulkan]

I fully understand you, Galak. As said, I talked in general about the same concepts than you. I guess.

I am not saying you're against it. My comment was in the sense that most of us sometimes forget that Crowfunding is not only an opportunity for buyers to get sexy discounts, but also to support the idea itself with any amount of money. Maybe is something a little bit phylosophical, but indeed it is. Crowfunding is about support ideas without convincing a bank to invest, about feedback... not only about stretch goals (that, BTW, are helping a LOT to launch a project).

I just quoted you sentence comparing the suitability of set up a pre-order instead of a Flexible Funding campaign...

My other point is that we have examples that fixed funding is not accomplishing their goals after being funded, which is also quite dangerous for the system to be trusty. So I guess that Flexible Funding and risky; and Fixed Funding and safe are not so linked concepts than presented.