How cool is AG5, really?

[mattgslater]

AC/CL (1 each is a wash, broadly speaking. In my mind, there's a penalty for intermittent rewards (probably why I down-value POMB compared to other coaches), so it's only worth it if you have a very good case to make.

These are the teams I generally consider going AC/CL on (1 each except as noted):
* Chaos Pact (over 1.25M, after Leader)
* Elves
* Goblins (or any other team dependent on Secret Weapons)
* Halflings (x3 each)
* High Elves
* Khemri
* Lizardmen
* Necromantic
* Nurgle (stymie)
* Skaven (especially)
* Undead
* Vampires

Conditions that make AC/CL desirable: 2 of the following makes it worthwhile
1) Expensive TRR
2) Style dependent on forcing opponent to roll dice
3) Significant expectations of either offensive scoring or repeated scoring (hard to stall on, not good at stalling)
4) Halflings

League conditions:
1) Lots of fast opponents
2) Lots of opponents who need their RR
3) Expect to be giving up FAME 1 a lot
4) Expect to use a lot of Chef

[JJB]

Two additional reasons for A/Cs and CLs in my not-so-humble opinion:

1- how often you are forced to make rolls on players you don't always want to
(main case scenario: a weak (i.e. less bashy) team against a strong one. Their cage is unbreakable so all you can do is slow it down, while your opponent keeps moving forward with his ST4 guys who mark at least 3 of your players each time. All you can do is dodge away and thus have to roll dice... Unless this is covered in one of your points, but I couldn't see it.

2- how unlucky you are
For example, I get an average of 2 double skulls per game. Really.
In my very last game, double skulls were the first or second things I rolled in each of the turns where they happened - I had to burn a reroll as I had a lot more things (involving rolls) to do. I was very glad I had ACs and CLs who got me that 4th reroll or I would have lost the game.

[Jimmy Fantastic]

AG 5 is awesome and totally worth the TV. Even AG 6 is well worth the TV.

[Aliboon]

Code: Select all

Even AG 6 is well worth the TV.

Funny fella.
AG6
in FUMMBL!?
Troll.

[Hitonagashi]

Code: Select all

Even AG 6 is well worth the TV.

Funny fella.
AG6
in FUMMBL!?
Troll.

Sure it's worth it.

No serious player passes a lot anyway on FUMBBL, and AG is all about dodging and picking up the ball. AG 6 is always better than AG 5 at that, so it's a great choice.

[mattgslater]

No serious player passes a lot anyway on FUMBBL, and AG is all about dodging and picking up the ball. AG 6 is always better than AG 5 at that, so it's a great choice.

Only faced with a -2 penalty or worse. 'Course, that does happen. Not sure I wouldn't take Leap instead.

[Hitonagashi]

Yep, -2 is a really common penalty. AG 5 it's possible to position around. On average, your opponent will fail 3 3+ rolls, so a simple double layered screen will stop an AG 5 player most of the time from just sprinting straight through.

An AG 6? You need 3 TZ on somewhere to even slow him down, and it's very hard to prevent him from making 2-3 of those. An AG 6 player can just dance straight through your lines, and if he's got dodge, it's usually more reliable than leap. The only way to really stop him is to literally form a line with no gaps...and that's a lot of players to have to devote when there's 10 other dudes on the pitch.

[Digger Goreman]

Three pages on whether supra-cheese is cooler than super-cheese... ... will wonders never cease

[mattgslater]

Not just elves, Dig. All-Blodge elves! Bwahahahahahahaha!

[Smurf]

I prefer Drestle or is it Wrodge?

Ha your players are on the ground which means they cannot hurt me... ooh less tackle zones to run through, cool!

[mattgslater]

I prefer Drestle or is it Wrodge?

Ha your players are on the ground which means they cannot hurt me... ooh less tackle zones to run through, cool!

There's definitely something to be said for Wrodge. I like it too. I find I throw more blocks than the average elf, so a mix suits me best: usually I do 3-4 Wrodge linos and a Catcher, and Blodge on everyone else.

[spubbbba]

Three pages on whether supra-cheese is cooler than super-cheese... ... will wonders never cease

Well all teams bar Khemri can aquire AG5 so it’s relevant to most teams.

After all filthy, cheeseball Necros would be even more broken with an AG5 ghoul, wight or wolf.

[swilhelm73]

I had an ag5 wight on my necro team and it was mostly bloat to be honest.

He was so much TV that if I ran him deep he was a major target, and with two MB/Claw wolves I didn't want him to blitz generally.

Now ag4 on wights is quite worth it - as most dodges will be 2+.

[mattgslater]

I had an ag5 wight on my necro team and it was mostly bloat to be honest.

He was so much TV that if I ran him deep he was a major target, and with two MB/Claw wolves I didn't want him to blitz generally.

Now ag4 on wights is quite worth it - as most dodges will be 2+.

This has been my experience with AG3 teams: AG4 is awesome, AG5 is just expensive. Ditto lots of AG4: I think 2x is the point of diminishing returns. This is part of my concern with this guy, that the extra AG point will become bloat if I roll 11 on a Catcher. But I think it's different for AG4 teams, because the purpose is different. You can't just man-mark one of my guys and call it a day like you can with a Zombie. So locking out this specific guy or that one is so much less valuable. The way to beat a Necro-type team is to neutralize the skill players: better and better skill players punish you more for failing to do this, but don't necessarily make it all that much harder. If you try to single out the skill players on an elf team, well, good luck: it's everybody!

[Smurf]

IMO AG6 is a bloat because utlising the ability is very limmited.

AG5 is godlike in most circumstances.


Even AG3 teams with access to mutations can mix +1AG with mutations. IIRC the top beastman could have +2AG and long legs and extra arms means it can intercept on a 2+ which is highly unlikely.