Underworld troll rolled 6/6

[Oni]

Deciding between strength up and block. (leaning towards strength)

[Smeborg]

A very interesting question, Oni.

I have not had the good fortune to roll 6,6 with a Warpstone Troll. Normally I lean towards +ST on a Big Guy, however, this may simply reflect my love of Nurgle...

For the Warpstone Troll, I might instead incline towards Block, for the reason that he is a "killer" player, one of only 3 on the team (the others being the Storm Vermin). Claw is my first normal skill for the Troll; Block would seem to complement this well, followed perhaps at some stage by M-Block (I do not favour P-On on this team).

While on the other hand, +ST could be followed by interesting variants, such as Tentacles, my playing experience suggests that Underworld work best when they are moderately killy (3 players with M-Blow, Claw and Guard). Thus suggesting Block.

Let us know what you pick and how you get on with it.

All the best.

[JJB]

Underworld's weakness is their unreliability. Giving your troll block helps address that, while a move up from 5 to 6 in strength won't make a big difference in comparison.

[Darkson]

ST, but then I use my UW troll as a hold up with tentacles rather than hit things with it.

[inkpwn]

+ST as much as I love block on big guys my troll tends to find himself without guard assists and the only team mate to help usually behind him. He's also less a hitter and more an extravagant catapult.

[JJB]

I made a mistake about the number of big guys underworld can field: I change my vote to +ST, agreeing with the above points.

[Smurf]

Block. Most of the time it can be used. ST 6 is only good against ST5 players.

Ok tentacles but +2 ST over everone else is fairly good. Rolling 7s or less means got you. And yest ST6 means rolling 8s or less for the same.

[mattgslater]

+ST: you can't really spam Block anyway, so this guy won't be your weak link if he never gets Block. But I don't think it's a major call.

[Rewslaun]

I think you need to go Block all the way. The only way I'd give him the ST is if you plan on giving him Tentacles at some point.

[Hitonagashi]

+ST purely because he's best with tents and not being activated.

If you use him to hit things a lot, go with block.

[DixonCider]

took str up on a mino and have never regretted, guessing the same logic applies to the troll

[txapo]

i think Block is better but if you finally go for ST break takle then is a must have!!

[mattgslater]

i think Block is better but if you finally go for ST break takle then is a must have!!

... after Tentacles.

[Hitonagashi]

i think Block is better but if you finally go for ST break takle then is a must have!!

Disagree here.

The whole idea of a big guy is not to activate them. Even with ST 6, I'd take Tentacles/Guard/Stand Firm (and claw, but that kinda defeats my point) ahead of Break Tackle.

Putting it simply, if you want to use Break Tackle you have to roll 2x 2+ without a rr (loner). That's only a 70% chance of success. For an approximately equal comparison, if you wouldn't be comfortable making a -2d blitz with a Block player on a non-block player needing to put them down in that situation, don't use Break Tackle to blitz or move with big guys.

PS. Block comparison involves having a RR.

[mattgslater]

It's the same odds as a 1/2d block for a non-skull: 25/36. And it's better than that, really, because 55% of fails don't turn you over, cost you an action next turn, or yield an AV roll. It's still not very good until after at least two doubles. For me, it boils down to one basic thing: if you have to dodge with your BoN, you have already screwed the pooch. He should be pounding it down, or doing nothing, or standing up and stepping back into place, or some combination thereof, probably 12-14 times a game. Plus the occasional move action, sure, because life happens. But optimally, you'd use Break tackle (to beautiful effect) once every three games or so, pegging it as a late skill at best. Certainly not before Guard, SF, or Tentacles. Not before Claw, either. Heck, with Guard, SF, Tentacles and Claw, I'd want Grab. 'Course, with ST6, Guard, SF, Tentacles, and Claw, I'd want 100 SPP.