Sure Hands for elven throwers???

[Fronko]

Hey out there!

At first it seems like a no-brainer to take it, but on second thoughts...

General knowledge says to start a rookie elf team with many linemen and only few positions, to allow reasonable ff and rr in the starting roster. Consequently, these linemen pick up the ball and quick pass it to someone else (your thrower, if available), to gain SPPs more quickly.

You see the pattern? Even IF there is a thrower around, he will NOT BE THE ONE to pick up the ball. If anything, he should get catch, as he will always be the target of those lineman passes (controversial thesis, ain't it?).

So, why give him sure hands? To counter strip ball? Usually, he will be far enough in his own backfield to be out of blitzing range and next turn he darts forward, hurling the ball to some receiver.

So, I'd suggest taking sure hands only as 3rd or 4th skill, when the linemen have their skills. Earlier, of course, when building that defensive thrower.

Logic reasoning or a dumb mind's foolishness?

[Zombie]

Your idea may sound good for team development, but for winning games, the fewer chances you take, the better your chances. That means picking up the ball with your sure hands thrower rather than with a skill-less line-elf. An elf thrower should always take sure hands as his first skill.

Of course, you can always give him catch as well!

[Valen]

I always give Accurate, then Sure Hands.

DAMN 1's THE CURSE OF THE ELVES!

[DoubleSkulls]

I'd agree with Fronko. Sure Hands is a waste on an Elven thrower - unless you want to develop him as a runner.

If I was worried about him getting hit take dump off instead. S Hands only works well if you've got Block and/or dodge too.

[Thor]

I agree with Fronko & Ian. My primary skill choices for my "offensive" HE thrower are accurate and strong arm (on doubles). As a secondary thrower skill, I had never considered catch, but after reading Fronko's logic, I am tempted. A typical play for me is to have a lineman pick up the ball and quick pass to my thrower, catch could come in handy.

I haven't yet developed a "defensive" thrower, but if I did, sure hands would be a consideration.

[Kamikaze Rudy]

Accurate is nice and all, but my jaw has hit the floor many times as my opponent's Sure Hands, Dodge Elven thrower walked into two tackle zones, snagged the ball without using a reroll, dodged out and thrown a touchdown with there being nothing that I could possibly do.

Elves can't afford many rerolls, the ones they do have shouldn't be used to pick up the friggin ball.

[McDeth]

Sure hands also helps counter against Strip Ball.

I'd take sure hands on 1 thrower and Accurate on the second.

[sean newboy]

Personally i would give sure hands to a line elf and have him hand off to the thrower to whom i would give catch. That way u get to keep the thrower closer to the los and therefore closer to the endzone.

[Heiper]

I am very torn on this subject tbh. I have a thrower under dev. right now, and haven't really put my mind to what I should give him yet. He is developing slow tho, my thrower is the worst thrower on the team, the lineelf at least can throw the ball without getting a fumble. But he will get there in time, I hope

Sure hands is great to counter the blitzers with Strip Ball, and it helps you with the RR issue, AND helps you to pick up balls in crowded areas. That last bit can maybe push me over to SH. But then again, now that I have an AG5 WD, he usually takes care of those issues.

Accurate and Strong Arm sure makes him a player that can throw the ball a long way without much fear of the dreaded fumble (double 1 will still get that tho), and this is usually the way I play. He is deep down, next round he throws the ball quite a long way up to the catchers. Easy TD. If I miss tho, the ball will get either caught by the other team or they put lots of TZs on it.

Just can't make up my mind

[NightDragon]

Surehands is one of the last skills I would give an Elf although I see the logic behind Zombie's argument. I think you should make the actual process of throwing as solid as possible and gamble that you will pick up the ball. You have to be pretty unlucky not to.

[Dinaturz]

IMO it depends on the level of the team.

If it is a new teams playing against other new teams (or with few experience), then Sure Hands will not be my first choice.
Otherwise, strippers will start to become such a treat that you will have to modify your tactics to face them.

In this case SH is for me a *must* ability.

[NightDragon]

Yeah, but I would wait to see if SB is used and not gamble that it will be.

[Amon242]

I didn't believe in Sure Hands on elves until I took it. It may not be the sexiest skill out there, but as it was said before by Rudy, there are better things to use a reroll on than picking up the ball. Also the elf already passes as good as a human thrower with accurate, so you have some room to work with in giving it to them as the first skill. Just make 10 more completions(what 2 games? ) and then you can start working up the passing skills.

[wesleytj]

fronko's whole assumption depends on his play style.

i don't start my elf teams with throwers, but once I have one, he's always the one picking up the ball. so yes sure hands is absolutely the first skill he takes.

[DoubleSkulls]

Accurate is nice and all, but my jaw has hit the floor many times as my opponent's Sure Hands, Dodge Elven thrower walked into two tackle zones, snagged the ball without using a reroll, dodged out and thrown a touchdown with there being nothing that I could possibly do.

This is the best argument in favour of Sure Hands. I'd be quite happy to develop my 2nd thrower this way (Sure Hands & Nerves of Steel :drool:). Strip Ball shouldn't be that dangerous to a thrower who can chuck the ball long distances without fear.

IMO the 1st thrower ought to be a long bomb specialist so accurate, strong arm & safe throw as the top priorities. Not too much room there for Sure Hands.