Best value for TV

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Hitonagashi
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Re: Best value for TV

Post by Hitonagashi »

RogueThirteen wrote:For teams like Chaos and Lizardmen, I suppose Block on a Warrior/Saurus is best, but it doesn't give you much value and won't really make much, if any, difference to your team's next performance. The odds that the Block skill will actually be useful on the blocks that that particular saurus throws over the other five, for instance, isn't great. When three or four pick up Block, though, then you start to get some reliability and can really appreciate the return.

That being said, my vote would be for Break Tackle on a Saurus. That builds up some immediate reliability by letting you keep a saurus safety back who can always free up for a blitz. For Chaos, I'd say Extra Arms or Sure Hands on a Beastman would probably yield the most noticeable and immediate return.
Strongly disagree with Lizardmen.

Block gives you a reliable blitzer, who at low TV can actually put opponents down. You don't need break tackle on a saurus safety back...just don't let people mark him!

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RogueThirteen
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Re: Best value for TV

Post by RogueThirteen »

Hitonagashi wrote:
RogueThirteen wrote:For teams like Chaos and Lizardmen, I suppose Block on a Warrior/Saurus is best, but it doesn't give you much value and won't really make much, if any, difference to your team's next performance. The odds that the Block skill will actually be useful on the blocks that that particular saurus throws over the other five, for instance, isn't great. When three or four pick up Block, though, then you start to get some reliability and can really appreciate the return.

That being said, my vote would be for Break Tackle on a Saurus. That builds up some immediate reliability by letting you keep a saurus safety back who can always free up for a blitz. For Chaos, I'd say Extra Arms or Sure Hands on a Beastman would probably yield the most noticeable and immediate return.
Strongly disagree with Lizardmen.

Block gives you a reliable blitzer, who at low TV can actually put opponents down. You don't need break tackle on a saurus safety back...just don't let people mark him!

Fully disagree. Block is usually moot, as early on most of the key blitzes you will need to make will often be against blitzers who already have the Block skill. So having Block yourself really doesn't yield much for a safety, except keeping you on your feet during a bad block. My saurus safety has Break Tackle and Tackle only (no Block), and he's won me at least five or six of the team's 24 TT Games pretty much himself. A good opponent will mark or screen your sauruses to basically mire you down and force you to blitz unmarked opponents with skinks or not at all. Even if they are trying to mark off your BT saurus so that BT won't yield much mobility, it means they are committing and extra one or two players to just coral that one saurus, and that's going to leave them weaker elsewhere. A saurus who can get out of coverage is an absolute necessity for any Lizard team, and at the very least makes a much bigger difference than having one saurus with block to act as a blizer. Because you bet your opponent will just mark that piece every turn, so it won't be functional blitzer.

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Re: Best value for TV

Post by Smurf »

Nice R13, I like your thinking.

BB does not revolve around Block, it is useful but it fills a slot in the skill section.

I like the idea of 6 break tackle, tackle sauruses. Making them mobile would be scary.

Maybe go as crazy as: Mighty Blow, Tackle, Break Tackle... then block?

Going back a bit.

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Ullis
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Re: Best value for TV

Post by Ullis »

The beauty of Block and Wrestle is you can actually block reliably. The difference between failure in 1 in 9 and 1 in 36 is immense.

It helps with offence when you have to block those players on the los and especially with rookie teams you're often blitzing players with Block. Block is especially helpful against players that start with Dodge. Without Block you need to POW them.

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RogueThirteen
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Re: Best value for TV

Post by RogueThirteen »

Ullis wrote:The beauty of Block and Wrestle is you can actually block reliably. The difference between failure in 1 in 9 and 1 in 36 is immense.

It helps with offence when you have to block those players on the los and especially with rookie teams you're often blitzing players with Block. Block is especially helpful against players that start with Dodge. Without Block you need to POW them.
No argument here, my Lizard team is 5x Saurus with Block and 1x Saurus with Break Tackle, Tackle, and Guard.

Block is great and necessary, but when it comes to one regular skill making the most difference, for Lizards I'd say it's got to be Break Tackle on a Saurus (way more valuable than 1 Block Saurus). Early on, when you're ST4, you'll just have to suck up those 1/81 times you turn over during a 2D-Block (assuming you're throwing them with a TRR handy).

My Lizards are actually near the bottom (if not at the bottom) of our TT League's teams when it comes to CAS caused (even compared to the human and elf teams that either far outpace or rival my tally), and that's because I played them very conservatively early on was pretty stingy in throwing blocks. I opted for controlling space (Break Tackle, Sidestep, Diving Tackle) instead of the standard Block + Mighty Blow spam, which I'm still not convinced is always the best default choice for teams, ESPECIALLY Lizards, whose biggest weakness is their complete lack of flexibility when it comes to controlling the space of the pitch (only 4 of your fielded players can do anything with the ball, your blockers can't move if marked or screened, and four of your players can't afford to participate in the blocking war hardly at all = YIKES!). It's insanely easy to get caught out of position as Lizards, and once you do things start going really badly for you very quickly usually exponentially increasing as your skinks start to fall. Break Tackle does a lot to mitigate this danger, certainly a lot more than one Block.

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Hitonagashi
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Re: Best value for TV

Post by Hitonagashi »

Hmmm, fair enough.

Each to their own, I detest break tackle...it involves making a 2+ dodge without dodge on a team that relies on it's rr's before it gets enough block.

I much prefer to just leave a sweeper unmarked and position around always having one free. It's not too hard to always guarantee it if you keep your saurii paired up, such that one can block the other free, or stay as a backfield sweeper.

Personally, I don't take break tackle till 5th skill on saurii, and I've never had any problems without it.

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